J.R.: 0:00

Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of 1000 Gurus with me, your host, jr Yonacruz. So today's guest is a repeat guest. He is back for part 2, ray Lee. So Ray is a concept artist, environment concept artist and digital art teacher in Los Angeles, california, but he will be moving back to his home country of South Korea. He creates 2D concept art, including environment props, illustration, logo and character design to professional standards, showing his designs problem-solving quality in the game and entertainment industry. He has a passion for creating gaming universes that captivate players' imagination.

J.R.: 0:38

So, as I mentioned in the episode, ray is my very first repeat guest.

J.R.: 0:41

We've had to schedule it in sooner than expected since he's moving back to his home country, but it was nice to follow up on some of the topics we didn't get to in part one, notably working as an international concept artist in the gaming industry, ai and ethical challenges in art, as well as the mindset to be successful in this profession. It was a shorter than normal episode, but it was such a perfect follow-up to the first one, so hopefully you guys will get a lot out of this, especially if you really enjoyed the first one. So, without further ado, hope you enjoy this episode with Ray Lee Ray, welcome back to the show. Hello, thank you for joining us again. You are my first repeat guest, so it is a pleasure to have you, to kind of break the ice on that, and it's also kind of special because the reason why we had you on so soon is because you're moving back to korea, right yeah to pursue more of like your, your career, concept, art, design, that stuff in korea also.

J.R.: 1:36

You'll be back to like, see your family and all that stuff. So I'm excited for you and your new endeavor and adventure going back to korea. But you'll be missed, course, and I'm sure you'll miss hanging out in LA and all that stuff.

Ray: 1:46

But yeah, happy to have you back. Thank you, yeah, I know.

J.R.: 1:50

Yeah, of course, and we had a lot of stuff that we didn't get to in the first episode, so I think we wanted to have a part two, obviously, anyways, so we're just doing it sooner than later.

Ray: 1:59

So yeah, any clarifications on what you're up to or what's going on in your immediate future before we jump into topics well, as you just explained, I'm like in a process of going back to my home country, which is south korea, but I haven't been there more than five years, so it's kind of feels like a new place for me to be honest and, as I mentioned in the previous episode, it's not.

Ray: 2:23

It is my home country, but I'm. It's really hard to say it's actually home country for me because I didn't live there the entire of my life.

J.R.: 2:30

Yeah, because you were. You've been jumping around since you were younger to different places and stuff like that. And your parents lived there, right, yes, right, and so I was gonna say so. Five years, I mean, I think I know, but so you haven't been back to south korea in five years, but your parents or your mom visited recently, or something like that yeah, she did it.

Ray: 2:47

I mean, it's like last year when I was like graduating and that was the time I the first time I was like seeing her after I got back to the states yeah, so how are you feeling about moving back?

Ray: 2:58

I guess, just just to recap, it's very like nervous and kind of exciting and it's more like I'm like kind of prepared for what's going to be happening because, as most of people know about south korea's like society's like impression is pretty highly competitive I mean everywhere are highly competitive but more like cultural wise and everything, it's kind of also impacting the society. So I think that's why I'm like all right, let's change my mindset, which is not going to be a same as here. So that's like how I'm like trying to transfer myself, I see yeah, cool, yeah.

J.R.: 3:35

So you're gonna have to, you know, be prepared for anything, but you're gonna be adaptable. And it kind of goes into our first topic, which is and thank you for helping me brainstorm these questions as well. I think it was very thoughtful. So first topic is career growth as an international concept artist. And so you are an international concept artist, and so the first question, which is what are the pros and cons of starting with contract work or freelance work as an international concept artist?

Ray: 4:00

I think, as an international concept artist, we have the restriction because of our visa status, because we are under the international student visa, which is called the F1 visa. Because of that, we can only work that is really related to our degree, like how we earned the degree. For example, I earned a degree by doing a lot of digital painting, traditional drawing, traditional painting. So I can go out of this boundary. For example, I can do the art manager in the game company, because art manager relate to the art team, but they don't really do artwork daily. They do the commenting and the managing it. So it's that's the different part. So when we go back to the contract and the freelancing, there's one more constraints that we have to meet the requirement of the minimum working hour per week, which is 20 hours per week. So that's the two thing that we have to be super careful when we actually register the freelancing or contract through the company okay, and so you said there was pros and cons to that sort of thing.

J.R.: 5:17

Well, like, what are those?

Ray: 5:18

I'll say the pros will be same as just regular, freelance or the contractor. We have our own schedule so we can work on the project the company provides it and at the same time, we can do a different job to earn extra income. That's the pros and the cons will be. You don't have a stable status, so you have to always be aware about stable status, so you have to always be aware about am I not getting it like expire my status while I'm like working with the sum of the company as a contractor?

J.R.: 5:52

or freelancer, okay. So more flexibility, but basically less quote-unquote stability in a sense yes right, that makes sense. So then, I guess, from that perspective, how can international artists expand their job opportunities? I guess, from that perspective, how can international artists expand their job opportunities outside of the US, and are there better job markets in other countries?

Ray: 6:09

Well, at this moment just the game job in general as the junior concept artist. It is really tough out there. Still, as I mentioned on the previous episode, I think it didn't really change that much Because a lot of companies are more looking for hiring the experienced artists. So still, I guess european country and some of the asian country are still providing the remote like work opportunity to the junior concept artists. I think that will be a good chance for the beginners to grab the ideas and also start their career outside of the states so they can actually build their resume.

J.R.: 6:55

Yes, okay, so there are other markets out there besides the us that will lend opportunities to those more junior, less experienced concept artists exactly gotcha. Do you know of any right now? From top of mind that you know, you mentioned Europe. Yeah. Are there any other markets that you think are more beginner accessible?

Ray: 7:15

Based on my experience, I think Ukraine has some of the opportunity for the junior concept artists, or Italy some of the opportunity for the junior concept artists, or italy, and sometimes if you gain company from switzerland, they kind of asking for the opportunity. The like junior concept artists in the states which it's kind of they only provide the the money through their currency, not the us dollar. So that's going to be a little bit a difference for the artist to like apply for the job and then figuring out how to receive the payment okay, so the payment wise is a little bit more tricky yes gotcha.

J.R.: 7:55

So I know you're moving back to south korea, but would you consider any of those other markets and, if so, what would be your top like I don't know top places that you would want to go into? You mean more like a game studio maybe game studios, but I'm thinking like on the topic of international and like countries or stuff like that. Do you have any insights on what your top favorites might be?

Ray: 8:18

I think I will just be more trying to like looking for the game industry in korea. Thankfully they have a lot of junior concert artist opportunity out there so I could apply and trying to see what's their like trend is and how they really think about their pipeline. I think that's the challenging part for me to understand when I'm going back to korea. Otherwise I think I'll be just more be flexible about where do I can use my like artist skill in a different field. For example, I can create the emoji on the. You know like a platform there you can sell your art, so it's kind of becoming like a passive income ish system.

J.R.: 9:02

Yeah, I see. So your top market would still be south korea, but you'd be open to applying your art to other industries yeah, and other countries, I guess right.

Ray: 9:12

So it's really hard to say which country it is, because right now everything is very global gotcha.

J.R.: 9:17

So that's why I was like it doesn't really matter too much about the country, but right like the industry and or like the company.

Ray: 9:22

Exactly that's why I was mentioning the platform that I can use it like globally, so I have a global like audience. I can earn some of the income, which sometimes it's like us dollar, so which is really good opportunity for me, okay yeah.

J.R.: 9:36

So I guess a little tangent off of that if you could live in any other country besides us and south korea to do work for, let's say say your ideal companies. Do you have a top three countries you'd like to live in, Countries or cities that you'd like to live in?

Ray: 9:50

I'll say the Japan. For sure, tokyo will be a really great opportunity to live, and second place will be, I'll say, finland.

J.R.: 10:01

Oh Finland.

Ray: 10:02

Yeah, because Finland is really like nature-friendly place and I've been there before throughout through the travel, so it was nice experience to like getting a lot of inspiration from the actual like environment from the Finland.

J.R.: 10:18

Okay, so the environment, yeah, but not Scandinavian Right People walking.

Ray: 10:25

And I think the last part will be, I'll say, san francisco it's still a state yeah yeah, but I just have some of the like feeling of what will be like feel different if I live in the san francisco. I never had a chance so, yeah, definitely different vibe.

J.R.: 10:41

I'm from the bay area, so I'm familiar with san francisco but yeah. I think you're right. It's more one of those hubs of like startups tech and all that stuff like that. So it would be interesting to work there. Cool On that note. So just kind of backpedaling a little bit. So you went to Otis. Do you feel like an American education gives you an advantage in the international gaming industry market?

Ray: 11:07

I'll say yes. There's two reason.

Ray: 11:10

One is they provide the insight about, like how to become the concept artist in general more insight than like other schools yes, because I think the oldest just gave me a lot of the room for me to think about how to become an artist like the mindset wise, so I can think about I do have a possibility of being a character artist or the environment concept artist in the game industry in the future. Like other than me only think about I can just become a concept artist. So they're giving a lot of tryout like system to understand what's going on in the industry, other than they just focus on only the techniques or only the information.

Ray: 11:57

They known so far. So I think that's the freedom that I. I think the second part will be the connection Connection from people who already graduated, people who are already working in the industry. I think they provide a lot of feedback and also their know-how if they are international students. So I think that helps me to grasp the idea about how to survive as the international concept artist in the States.

J.R.: 12:28

Okay, so I know your experience at Otis was good because you learned a lot of functional knowledge, not only of the art but also how to be in the industry. But also the network was valuable. So now, stepping back, do you think, as someone who's applying for these jobs, do you think having an American school on your resume is probably more of an advantage than, say, having going to a school in another country international school. Do you think that gives you an advantage, saying it's an American school?

Ray: 12:58

I think I can explain it two way again. First I'll say yes, it will give some of the benefits because it's kind of verified that you went through the four years of college like education system. So people will have the kind of positive like stereotype that oh, this person can at least execute an amount of the work and has amount of the dedication. So that kind of proves it on my diploma.

J.R.: 13:26

But at the same time I'll say no to that question because it's not necessarily like where you graduate, but how good is your work, your portfolio, your experience, etc. So you're saying it could go either way. Yes, makes sense. So last thing on this topic is how should international artists prepare for industry instability from your insights and perspective? Like layoffs or hiring slowdowns? I feel like that's a concern in a lot of people's industries, but what are your thoughts on that?

Ray: 13:53

I think for that aspect we need to build at least A to C plan, which is three different plans, to be aware about the layoff. And these days the game industry is like a situation as an international student. So for me my first plan A is applying for the job as a game concept artist in the industry. And then plan B was trying to look for some of the slightly different design field, for example for what I have known so far. Trying to look for some of the slightly different design field.

Ray: 14:24

For example, like for what I have known so far, concept artists can also have chance to apply for the toy industry because they sometimes looking for the illustrator, I see, and actually like a concept artist position. So that kind of gives you room for the concept artist to apply for the different design field. And also, rarely sometime you can apply for the graphic designer like position which you are handling like packaging, illustration part. So that kind of helps. And then plan c, which is I'm currently using, it is working in the private like art education system which I apply for the job to the like a private art institution out there in the states and I work as the digital art, like teacher slash, like traditional art teacher so I can teach the student from like different ages. That helps me to kind of stay on the track and then like visa state-wise and then I can still looking forward to get my priority like plans opportunity out there.

J.R.: 15:25

Okay, so just having multiple plans is basically like the best way in any industry to prepare for like changes or instability and whatnot.

J.R.: 15:33

Yeah, nice, yeah, I think that's very good advice, I think, in general, for whatever industry you come from. Alright, so next topic is AI and ethical challenges in the game art industry. Ai and ethical challenges in the game art industry. So how are studios balancing AI tools with traditional concept art workflows? So I know last episode you mentioned kind of like how AI is being combined or overlaid with the art process in your field. Would you like to elaborate on that?

Ray: 16:01

Yeah, nowadays, some of the companies are starting to use the AI technique to apply on their current game IP. I think one of the examples would be Activision's Call of Duty. They start to apply the AI tools on their game right now. So some of the users are experiencing kind of uncanny valley of feeling while they playing for the game. I think it was their like loading screen before they start the games. So I think that's the way the company is starting to adjust the new tool, or some of the company are actually stating that we are not going to use the ai tools at all and that we will fully respect the artists who are dedicated to make their own ideas other than actually using ai tools to bring some of the conflict between the artists and the game company, so it's a method.

J.R.: 16:57

Well, you're saying that some studios just have a disclaimer that, okay, we're not going to leverage AI tools and that's to appease the market or the client, the users, of their concerns with using AI. Oh, okay, interesting. I didn't know that there was pushback in that sense and the company's like okay well, fine, we'll ease off on that and let you guys know we respect the artists. So then how? Next question is how can artists, what can artists, do to protect their work from ai scraping and unauthorized use?

Ray: 17:27

I think that's a big thing for ai, since it's gone into art, sure I think there is like a different way to prevent your work get consumed by the a like open ai resources. I think the first one is you always check your social media platform where you upload your work and there's always a privacy setting that you have to turn off to your kind of consent to sending your artwork or data to the company's database to use it in a different way.

Ray: 18:00

They don't really mention they will use an AI tool, I think Meta. They mention on their privacy setting tools to say this will be consumed to the AI. We have to turn it off. But what I know is so far only the states are not having any option for turn it off on the Meta, which is like Instagram or their Facebook, so which that's kind of has the little bit gone to the vital, like last year. So right now people are more settled, so some people aren't actually not using instagram anymore to promote their art or some people are still like just uploading it, even if they realize the ai will consume their artwork in in the end. And then the last part. There's one university in the states. They developed the one of the program only for the artists to prevent their work to get stolen by the ai tool, which is called the glaze, like a glaze donut yeah yeah, so actually actually they digitally glaze on your artwork to prevent AI tools to recognizing it, scraping it.

Ray: 19:13

But that is not on the top level yet. They're still developing it from university. So when you kind of glaze your artwork it becomes a little bit less high-resoluted like artwork I see.

J.R.: 19:29

So there's like a drop back to that too. So then, what are industry professionals as concerns about ai in concept art and how is the industry responding? So I know you kind of just mentioned the, the pushback and the tools that could help prevent the use of that and what you can do as an artist. Either you don't upload or you upload certain places. But yeah, what are the concerns and how is the industry responding?

Ray: 19:50

I think right now it's kind of mixed response compared to the beginning. Beginning was more like people are feeling very like, against about the AI tools. Right now, some of the major companies, like, as I mentioned, like Activision they're starting looking for people who are like, have ability to handle the AI tools to make the work.

Ray: 20:16

So I think that people are just like okay I think we can just like move on to using the tools to develop our work more, faster and a better quality, and there's other half of people were saying that is still disrespectful about, like how we form this community, and then if we wanted longevity of this community, then we should keep the artist, the respectful aspect, other than we just continue to receiving what's going on in the around the world about the new technology I see it's almost like those sci-fi books or movies where it's like the purists versus the progressives right, we should use technology and steampunk to go into the future.

J.R.: 21:02

And so we were like, oh no, the the past and we need to preserve the integrity of that. It's very interesting, okay. So last question on this topic is how should aspiring concept artists adapt to ai without losing their artistic integrity?

Ray: 21:15

I think this is what I also heard it from my professional friends outside of the it's not outside of it, actually like people who are currently working in the industry. They're saying that if you want to maintain your artist aspect, you have to gain your design knowledge and then design skill so you can actually use the ai tool to let them paint your design work, which will be a sketch. Other than that, it's kind of becoming challenging for you to overcome having a better painting than the ai, because once you're not enhancing your fundamental art skill that I mentioned on the previous like episode, you'll get loosed by the ai or you'll be eaten by the ai, so you can't make a better work than the ai. So I think that's the main aspect. We should keep it in mind. So stay strong and then keep practicing on your fundamental art and then enhance your design ability so the company will notice the value in the future or even sooner. Okay.

J.R.: 22:28

And that makes a lot of sense. Still practice your fundamental art skill, but learn how to use the tools and leverage it just to develop your skill sets and whatnot Right, all right. So topic number three, if we want to move forward and leverage it just to develop your skill sets and whatnot, all right. So topic number three, if we want to move forward, is the mental and professional mindset of success. So how can concept artists stay motivated when facing long job searches, especially in today's tough market? So again, we're talking about how the market is really tough, and that's across a lot of industries and, as someone who's familiar with the job search being international and then looking for work, here and now you're going to be going back to South Crete to look for work.

J.R.: 23:03

What are some of your thoughts or insights on that?

Ray: 23:12

I think so far what I experienced. I'll say there's two main things that I should keep in mind. First, just do it Just like the quote that we know everyone knows yeah, nike, yes, Nike. Just do it just like the quote that we know everyone knows yeah, nike, yes, nike. And then, because, yes, we need a lot of like strategies or the plans to figure out how to survive as international, like artists in the states, but at the same time, if we are obsessed with the plan or the strategy that I build it up already, then if anything happened out of control things are happen then you will lose the motivation, which is becomes very toxic part to the artist, because art is like the language, very intangible aspect.

Ray: 23:53

If you're not keep using it, you will lose the ability. So, trying to separate yourself about the reality and then like doing the art by yourself, so trying to enjoy the art in general. I think that's the main aspect. I think the second part is always keep it in mind about the negative aspect too. Always keep it in mind about the negative aspect too, because I know everyone's are not really wanted to think about the negative aspect, but if you are kind of think about the negative aspect not too deeply. Then you will also have a better idea about how to like solving the problem, like how I did it right now or how I'm actually doing it right now, going back to like my home country and then looking for the game industry like market over there.

J.R.: 24:44

So that will helps you to keep stay on your main like motivation when you say the negative aspect, are you referring to the feelings of coming like hitting a wall and not really getting the results, or what?

Ray: 24:59

yeah, I think, the frustration from not getting any result from the job market and then plus with doubting about your skill, because you know when you're not getting the job market result, then you will start to doubting yourself that. Am I not like enough for this industry or am I not doing something like better than before? So trying to like, not thinking about those negative aspects, but trying to look at out the actual like, the facts. Like if you are have multiple chance to do the interview in the job market but you still didn't get any result, that means your portfolio is is on the green, like like it's not like red flag or anything.

Ray: 25:46

You have to understand that it's just like maybe I'm lack of the experience compared to the other candidates because, as I mentioned it earlier, all the position in the states are like senior or at least like mid-level. So the for the junior artists they're agreeing that your portfolio, if you get the interview, they're saying well, your portfolio, are close to that level, but your experience or maybe your interview like result was not great enough to get to your final like section yeah, makes sense.

J.R.: 26:20

So how do artists avoid burnout when balancing job applications, portfolio work and personal projects? So, again, like, balance is very important and if you're hitting the ground running and doing all these multiple things, obviously balance is a big issue, right? Yeah?

Ray: 26:34

I think there's three ways to prevent that burnout while you're preparing the portfolio and everything I'll say. First, make the timetable for your portfolio, just like how we went to the college and then have to every time have a time schedule for each semester. If you have that on track, then you will have a better idea of like where am I at? Right now and what should I do to finish this project other than you? Just, okay, let's just start making a character just do it.

Ray: 27:07

Yeah, yeah I think that doesn't really help. You need some of like actual plan, solid plan, and the second part is trying to have like your own like mentor, not just like you working on your art by yourself. You need to talk with the actual, like professional people out there to tracking yourself. Am I like still on the track on this like industry's like trend, or is it my portfolio quality are getting better?

Ray: 27:38

Because eventually, being an artist is that we could, most of the time we could like kind of obsess with our art, so we were losing the aspect about is my art looking good on the like commercial art field? Because this is not like actual, like contemporary art, because that's actually way different field. But we always have to satisfy the client and the game company. So that's why that's the importance of having the mentor out there. And the last part will be trying to give yourself to do the art that you like to do it most, which is following your desire. For example, for me, I love to do the a lot of like landscape painting without like actually designing my like landscape. I like to do the painting just like observing, painting literally or drawing the people out there while I'm like sitting on the coffee shop. So those kind of like doodling phase is very important for you to not getting burned out and also losing the motivation I like that a lot.

J.R.: 28:50

Those three points are pretty insightful. Actually, I don't want to read it because I think that was really good. Just go back and listen to that. How do personal projects help concept artists stay competitive and relevant? I think this is a great question because that's one of those the issues of you need job experience to get this entry-level job catch-22 thing which is okay, how do I get this job? I have no experience, but I need this job to get the experience.

J.R.: 29:15

And now it's like a loop right, and so the question is like how do personal projects help you to stay competitive so that you're doing something, but what are your thoughts on that? Could you?

Ray: 29:25

elaborate the question one more time. Yeah.

J.R.: 29:26

So how do personal projects help concept artists stay competitive and relevant?

Ray: 29:32

I think there's like two different ways. I think the first is building your portfolio. It's still counting as a personal project because what I understand so far, what I learned from the industry people, is that eventually for the junior concept artists, like your portfolio is equal to the personal project, but if you have experience and you have nda work, that's what we call the professional work. That's how I realized recognize the difference. So I think, stay on like track.

Ray: 30:05

Personal project will be always trying to see the trends of the game industry out there. For example, game is like game industry like trends, is like a fashion like trends. Yeah, it's a stay up to date. Yeah, it's keep cycle. So right now, this is like the moment where most of like popular games have a lot of medieval like era of the game style. Or they have a lot of like more than future style, which is like a lot of shooting games that are more a little bity like outfits and a lot of techy graphics are out there. Or the other part is they use a lot of popular animation IP to bring it to their game, for example, blizzard Entertainment's Overwatch game.

Ray: 30:51

They're creating a lot of game, the character's skin design based on bringing ip from japan's popular animation, so that kind of helps you to understand what's the trends out there and then you actually apply to that your personal project. For example, you can actually remake, redesign some of like already existing ip but, at the same time, you have to be very careful to not get obsessed with the original IP design style.

Ray: 31:20

So, I would highly recommend to start with your actual personal IP, other than just following the trends what actually game companies are doing out there.

Ray: 31:33

And then the last part will be you need to be setting up the portfolio's layout. What I mean by layout is the order of how you're trying to show your portfolio to the recruiters or the game company in general. For example, for me, since I'm an environment concept artist, on my website I try to show a lot of design ability about the environment concept artist. On my website I tried to show a lot of like design ability about the environment concept artists they require in the game industry. So I 80, I put a lot of environment concept artwork in a front low of my portfolio and then, when it goes scrolling and down, I show the character and the props, which is still relevant to the environment because it still has character and props inside. So that's how I build up my portfolio, based on how people are observing my work, to they trying to hire me or not I see, yeah, all right, as some, as a non-artist who does not have a portfolio, how do you approach building one?

J.R.: 32:39

Because you say adding to portfolio, constantly building it? Like, how do you know or decide what to draw, what to design, what to build in that order? And I know you mentioned following those trends, being up to date with what's relevant and then potentially developing your own style, but also taking other existing IPs and maybe making your own, but also taking other existing IPs and maybe making your own, making a spinoff, depending on what trends are there. But how do you decide what goes into that portfolio? If that question makes sense.

Ray: 33:07

Yeah, I mean there is a different way to decide how you're going to build your portfolio in the end. For example, it's kind of relevant to the previous episode how I mentioned about the stylization about the portfolio and everything, so that also included. After you actually decide your art stylization, for me I will. My work is heavily depends on like henley digital painting style, so I have to keep it on track about building my portfolio to being like handily painted and then plus with is that this will be going to be very cute and plus, since I'm an environment concept artist and my know how to paint a different day of the time and different weather, so that kind of like shows on my portfolio.

J.R.: 33:58

Those aspects. Yeah, the aspect you can do different sides to that.

Ray: 34:01

And then when it comes to the, since it's like technical art, you have to show your like understanding of the functionality of the design. Are you actually just creating the art or are you actually creating the art and design at the same time? Just like how I design my vehicle design on my website, Like is it this actually will be work in the real life? So those things are important, but when we purely just going back to the question to answer it, I'll say you really need the mentor.

Ray: 34:35

Of course, there is a lot of resources out there, you see there from Instagram or Facebook or even different education online platforms out there, but the one thing is that they are great artists. However, in any field, even if you're good at executing your work, they are not good at educating a lot of people how they want it to do. So some people will have a struggle to understand their information. If you purchase the package of online classes, Like a video course exactly. So you need like in-person mentor in your life to keep in track and also getting a full advice. I'm not saying like you should not like looking out the online classes out there.

J.R.: 35:24

Yeah, you will have opportunity like a lot of good resources out there, but mentorship is very valuable and it's very pointed or very specific that can like.

Ray: 35:34

Accelerate your growth and guidance it's more like they can help you to diagnose about your current status. It's like a coach, right?

J.R.: 35:41

they can see like your blind spots and figure out where you need to grow, better than just a blanket video course that just gives you general a to z right. Right, I like that. And yeah, thanks all for pulling up ray's portfolio. Those are really good image images and illustrations. Highly recommend everyone check out ray's portfolio. His work is gorgeous. As a non-artist myself, and I can appreciate good looking art as a newbie yes, his work is really good. Thank you, okay. So next question is how can junior artists deal with imposter syndrome and build confidence in their work?

Ray: 36:16

I think it's kind of like same thing how I answered your previous question, but I will say separate yourself about getting evaluated by the professional extender and trying to keep yourself and then think about the reason why you start this like path for your actual professional career.

Ray: 36:41

Because this is also kind of same as how you like being an adult, because once you've grown it up and getting out from all the education, military education system, you'll have a lot of interaction with different types of people that you haven't meet in your life right, and then you might have the time or the experience of getting hurted by what people other people are saying it to you or you'll have the struggle because of you couldn't recognize your like the bad part or the not a great habit to interact with the people.

Ray: 37:13

It's the same thing as in the art too. So trying to keep yourself that once people are like commenting about something about your art means they are not looking forward to just like doubting about your work. Actually they are the people who are trying to help you, unless they're really saying in a disrespectful way. So trying to being open-minded about getting a critics from outside and the separate yourself that this is just credit to help my work to get better and then consume that advice and trying to organize your thoughts before you actually doing your art. So this will help you to enhance your skills and also not getting too much stress from like when you're getting the advice or the critics out there so being good with taking feedback and critiques and whatnot and then improving and focusing on that.

J.R.: 38:11

Yeah, not necessarily imposter syndrome like how bad I am or I don't. I'm not meant to be here, but just focus on improving your work. Next one, or I guess the last one in the section, is what advice from senior artists has helped junior concept artists the most in their career growth senior concept artists, since they already went through the the junior level experience and everything, so they will.

Ray: 38:35

If you have chance to talk with the senior concept artists, they will give their insight about their experience, which is literally a shortcut. So, trying to create the opportunity, even like in person or online, like linkedin, like professional, like recruiting, like platform, trying to reach out them, even if it's embarrassing and it's pretty like pressure, and trying to get different types of the opinion from the different, like senior concept artists, for example, once you get that big data and then you will find out the common advice they are giving it. So trying to extract that common advice and then apply to your work, like habit or the workflow, or even your like art style, everything then it will help you to understand how to get to that like professional level.

J.R.: 39:27

Okay, so getting a lot of advice from a lot of different perspectives and kind of finding those common denominators or threads that connect everything and that helps you grow the most, basically. So basically, it's like a mindset of just consistent adaptation, learning and always seeking feedback and advice, and I think that makes sense for a lot of different career fields, right, yeah, I think that's it for, like the plan questions. But I think it reminds me I was having a conversation with a friend recently and they're UCLA student and I think most, like students, have this same sort of conception. I think we were talking about this. It's tough when you're in a competitive environment, let's say from a very competitive school or environment where everyone's doing all these amazing things and their portfolio is amazing and they're working with all these companies, and it's easy to compare yourself and, like you said, get into those negative mindsets of feeling like you're an imposter, feeling like you're behind and feeling like you are not going to make it in this tough economy and job market.

J.R.: 40:30

And I think what I said eventually is that I think people are aware that comparing doesn't help you. I think focusing on your improvement and growth, what you've been saying is very important, but I think the second thing that I was that came to mind was I feel like, aside from preventing yourself from feeling doom and gloom, the time horizons for you to be successful is a lot bigger than people think, because they feel like I have to figure out my stuff within the next two years, within my undergraduate even recent, like in my first two years of graduating and if I don't do that, then it's the end of the world. Right, but as adults, people who have been in the workforce for a lot longer, you have more time than you think to be successful. And not only that, but I think, if you, the big question and I know I'm tangent rambling, but the big question is how do I find the job security and stability in any industry?

J.R.: 41:25

And that's the question that a lot of those students or like early in your career people will ask. It's like how do I have job stability, because I do not want to get into this market and worry about having a job and getting fired and all this other stuff. And my thought is that how do you get job? Security is be really, really, really good at what you do, be that people will want to hire you. That there are no open positions at Google, let's say, but the Google manager, hiring managers will hire you, you anyways, because you're, you have a great reputation and you've done a lot of good stuff and you're the best in the industry, right? So the next question is how do you become very good?

J.R.: 41:56

at what you do right?

Ray: 41:58

that's really a insightful question for any industry out there because, as we know, more time pass the world trying to change really fast and a lot of stands are becoming very high quality and then looking for the fast result in any field. So at that point there is like pro and cons. Pro is you can have a lot of freedom to do anything and the cons is like you will get a lot of pressure and then you will feel a lot of stress how you explain feel behind from the college year to like after you graduated. So to try to realistically figure out that aspect, I'll say taking the advantage of how the world is changing, which is using the technology of like different like social media platform to self-promote yourself like, for example, like as the concept artists a lot of artists are low-key, mandatory to self-promote their self in any different like art platform.

Ray: 43:03

Yeah, so they're exhibiting, literally they're doing the art show by themselves on online to showcasing that. Do this amount of work a to z. So if you are getting interested, hit me up and then I will try my best to like respond and if we have a great opportunity, I will like always open to work together. So you show that constancy about like self-promoting yourself other than you obsess about the amount of the likes and amount exposed that you will get on the social media platform. That you might think that I'm getting popular or not, that's not important because, as everyone know, once the algorithm like kind of picks you up, yeah you will get vital. But I think that's not the important part if you're not good at your.

J.R.: 43:53

If your work isn't good, yeah, what's the point?

J.R.: 43:55

and if you're not promoting, or if you're not going out there and putting out your work, it's not going to go anywhere, yeah, yeah I like that a lot and also, too, I think there's a step back from that is self-awareness of what you meant to what you're meant to be doing. So, in your case, or in other people's cases, they know what they want to do and they have the self-awareness, like yourself, of okay, concept art, environmental concept artists you know, work in the video game industry. Some people don't really know what they want to do, right, and they might be pressured or influenced into three different industries. They're not really sure. But I think the point being is that if you have that self-awareness and you know that you really want to do a certain thing because, one, you're wired to do it naturally, because your brain works that way, and, two, you really enjoy it, so that you get something from it that allows you to be really good at it.

Ray: 44:40

I think the first, if you already have your self-awareness about what you like to do, you already figure out the big part, because a lot of people, as you mentioned, are still figuring out to find out what they love, because these days, working at the company in the traditional style will not help you to survive.

J.R.: 44:59

Yeah, like economical wise you're not going to be. You're not going to be in demand or the best and have job security. If you hate what you're doing, but you're in an industry that's quote-unquote stable. I hear that so many times. It's oh, I want to go into this industry. Why? Because it's stable, I'm like. But you don't love it and you're not good at it, so why would you ever be great at it and why would they ever keep you on the payroll?

Ray: 45:19

exactly yeah. So I think that's why recently, what I've been researching about the job market in general, like when I was trying to plan to going back to korea.

Ray: 45:29

I heard the term about the digital nomad. It's you don't have really a physical place to work, but you're working anywhere while you're traveling, like in a different city. So your work, for example, like as a korean, I'd go, I work at like fill in, for example, in europe, but I get the job in the fill-in to work remotely, but they still don't require you to submit your visa to stay there longer. You're like staying there like a couple months and but you're getting the experience and then you still get like constant income by register yourself in the like, a bigger global like platform that will assist the additional nomad people to work in any like country, so which that becomes like your personal business, because people will get scared about like when, say, I want to start the business means like we need a lot of money and then we need enough experience to and then learn about the industry and then run the business.

Ray: 46:31

That will help to like successfully run the business. Otherwise it will waste the money or the time. But I think nowadays that's not how it was used to be. It's it's very different. You can open your business on your instagram, for example, you can make a sticker like cute character for. You can make a sticker like cute character for me. I can make a cute character, yeah, and then upload it on the global platform, so people will purchase it and I can send the sticker around the world.

J.R.: 46:58

Yeah, open up an Etsy shop right now. Yeah, I like it. Okay, right, I think we're short on time, but this was such a fruitful conversation. I'm glad we were able to do part two, and I'm sure you know eventually, if it's in the cards, maybe a part three if it works out and when you come back, or something like that. So let's wrap this up. So we end, as usual, with gratitude. So, ray, I know we did this recently, but what are you grateful for?

Ray: 47:23

I think I'm grateful for, of course, for like podcast opportunity to getting know you while I'm like staying in the states, and then I could share this ideas to the people who are in the same page or people who will going to have a same page with me, so they will have less like stress, like moment.

J.R.: 47:43

Yeah, so I think that's the great full part for me nowadays yes, yeah, I appreciate and I'm sure the audience is too sharing your insights, your hard-earned insights, with the rest of us so we can take a peek and maybe learn something from that um, okay final ask from the audience or any takeaways you want them to have from the show besides, hire me in south korea.

Ray: 48:03

But other than that, other than that, I think, thanks for um spending time to listen my episodes, which is like. This is part two already and listen to part one.

J.R.: 48:16

That's my, that's my ask.

Ray: 48:17

It's a great episode, thank you yeah and then it is really honored to share my experience out there, even if there's not a lot of people are listening at the moment, but still still thanks for listening.

J.R.: 48:30

Yeah, of course, all right. Last thing I know it's going to be linked and it's in the first episode, but, ray, if people want to check out what you're up to or connect or anything like that, where can they find you?

Ray: 48:41

You can find me on the Instagram right below here. There you go, ray Lee R, on Instagram, and then you will see all the hyperlinks that relate to my professional work.

J.R.: 48:53

Nice and it'll have his face like that Right on there. Yes, cool. Well, all right, ray, thank you so much again for being here. I appreciate it. It was a lot of fun and it was a very fruitful conversation. And thank you for the brainstorm questions. Oh, no worries, again, shout out to Ray, shout out to Ray. He helped brainstorm a lot of these questions and I think they're very pointed and insightful. So for my final sign-off, thank you guys again for tuning in. As always, reminder to be kind to other people, especially yourself, and remember that you can always learn something from someone, even multiple times, if you just take the time to listen. So thanks for tuning in, thanks so much.