J.R.: 0:00

Hello everyone and welcome back to another fun episode of 1000 Gurus with me, your host, jr Yonacruz. Today's guest is Alex Hung.

J.R.: 0:09

Alex is the chief of staff at a startup that provides back office solutions for property managers, focusing on business enablement and strategy to grow the business and unlock operational challenges. He loves debating with friends to challenge his ideas and opinions, and his best friend is a white and gray Shih Tzu Teddy. So this was another fun episode with a fellow Kappa Modern alumni dance teammate from college, alex Hung and I don't get to catch up much between the years, but it was nice to chop it up about his career journey, insider tips as someone who used to work in HR and now works more in operations. We also talk about money management tips and then finally landed on the topic of dating and what he's learned over the years about understanding women. It was a very fun conversation and actually the last in my Cup of Modern series before we do our special five-person reunion episode with our class. So, without further ado, hope you enjoyed this episode with Alex Hung. You enjoyed this episode with Alex Hung. Hello everyone, and welcome back to 1000 Gurus, please welcome my guest.

J.R.: 1:13

Alex Hung, thanks for being here, man, I appreciate it.

Alex: 1:15

Yeah.

J.R.: 1:16

I know you are not too far, so I'm glad that we were able to schedule this out. Yeah, and then. So for those of you who don't know Alex is, I was going over the stats with him right before recording, but he is the third Alex on my show. He's the fourth person of my Cobb Modern class and he's the sixth person who I've had who was on Cobb Modern and probably like the 30th dancer, if I were to take stats, so yeah.

J.R.: 1:40

So we have some good stats there. So let me just go into how I know you. So, just, similar to June, alex, christal and Ken we met during our first year on Cabo Modern at UCI in 2010,. Right, yeah, I was the first year, you were a second year, I believe, and you were also a fellow freestyler, you were doing locking and I was like a freestyle popper, and so we danced together for a couple years and we, similar to again the other three we see each other about like once a year for our class socials, like christmas or something june related, like her going away, coming back, graduating, coming back again, getting married. So, yeah, and we live in buena park, right, and you have your own place and you have two cars such a flex. And you have a dog named such a flex. And you have a dog named Teddy, right, yes, sir, and you're also from the Bay Area, just like myself, correct? And again, I had to stalk you for this. So you have a degree in public health science, right? So useful.

Alex: 2:35

Yeah, yeah, no, I mean same Poli sci I don't do anything with that let's see.

J.R.: 2:39

And I know you used to work in HR but now your title right now is chief of staff. Is that? Does that sound right? Yeah, that's right, nice, cool. So now that we have that out of the way, or sorry, any clarifications? You got it. Anything else you're up to Bang on.

Alex: 2:54

No.

J.R.: 2:54

Okay, and you also went to Japan and Taiwan recently, right?

Alex: 2:58

I did Just like everyone else.

J.R.: 3:08

Just like everyone else. Yeah, yeah, I went last september.

Alex: 3:10

Like I mentioned, I'm going back in september, october, so we're all just basic following the crowd, so gotta take advantage before they raise the the tourist prices.

J.R.: 3:14

Yeah, yeah and all the tariffs cool, let's go into the first video. Solomon, if you don't wear the wiggles so yes alex is the green, I'm the blue. This is from zoolander jitterbug, alex's choreography. Here's my butterfly and that's it. Yeah, that's it. Thanks, solomon, all right, yeah, so so that was alex's choreo, my butterfly twist, and I think I contributed like four counts to that intro, like to the jada bug something it was probably that, something like that, but anyways, that set was super fun yeah, yeah, yeah, it was super fun and like oh, and there was another part, the whacking part, later.

Alex: 4:03

who did that? Can't remember right now, was it Amy?

J.R.: 4:07

Yeah, probably, amy Probably, or Jenny, I forget, it's okay.

Alex: 4:13

It's one of the whackers. Yeah, that was fun yeah.

J.R.: 4:16

Just want to throw in our history lore there. That was like what 13 years ago, 14, something like that. Cool, all right, you ready for our first topic? Yes, all right. So, as usual, first topic is always origin story. So like where did you grow up, what was like your career path and like main influences that kind of led you to where you are today? I know it's like a big like 30 plus years of life, but you could point to the main influences that got you to where you are today. That's too broad.

Alex: 4:45

Okay, where'd you grow up? Where'd I grow up? I grew up mostly in NorCal.

J.R.: 4:50

Yeah. What were your like aspirations when you were like younger?

Alex: 4:53

Truthfully, I didn't really know what I wanted to do. I just I think I was very driven by music. When I was starting middle school, I picked up drums and I thought that drums were the way to get girls because, music's cool and the coolest instrument. I probably should have picked up guitar in hindsight, but drums.

J.R.: 5:17

I thought was way cooler. Yeah, hey girl, come here, you can't carry it around.

Alex: 5:21

Let me pick you, it doesn't really work. So I started the drum thing and then that's where I think I put a lot of my creative energy in middle school, and then I also did it in high school with drumline and then afterwards there I went to uci and there was no drumline because there's no football team at UCI, which was bizarre. So I didn't really know where to take that and so I danced in college with you.

J.R.: 5:53

So then, how did you choose public health sciences, and what did your parents have anything about what you should be getting into?

Alex: 5:59

Okay, yes. So in college the main thing is what should I major in so that I have a career after this? And truthfully, I didn't really know or care. I just knew I needed to make money and I needed to have a life that I could afford the things that I wanted. So I think in college I didn't get a lot of direction, because no one went to college in my family previously a lot of direction, because no one went to college in my family previously, if anything, maybe like a little bit of community college is all.

Alex: 6:29

But I thought that the hardest major or majors would be the ones that also meant it would be a higher paying job, which now, in hindsight, is not true whatsoever. Like what? Like which one you would always think? Well, I thought that bio, chem, computer science that's partly true, computer science worked, uh, but bio and chem, those types of degrees did not really yield a great job market after you're either working in a lab or research or something right, it's kind of narrow. So those are the harder quote-unquote harder majors. It was very difficult. I tried to go for bio initially, a biology major, because I thought that was very hard. I wanted to challenge myself, but it came to a point where I had to switch in order to graduate on time because I spent a little bit too much time dancing.

Alex: 7:20

Yeah, as we all do, yeah so I just switched to whatever I could to graduate on time and honestly. After college I realized that the major you have doesn't matter at all, which is why yeah college is so useful.

J.R.: 7:34

Yeah, that's one of our later topics too. So then you switched into public health sciences to graduate on time, and then at that point, well, I guess one thing did your parents really care or what were their thoughts on that at that point? Well, I guess one thing did your parents really care or what were their thoughts on that at that point? Because I think people going to college at least asian households, it's usually like they tell us what to do, right, I don't know if it was like that for you I think because they don't have the experience they didn't, they weren't able to give an opinion okay, the

Alex: 8:01

main thing was make sure you graduate, make sure that the money that I mean I was fortunate enough that they were supporting me through school. I didn't have to pay for it myself, so thank you the equity from my house that they pulled out for that can't thank them enough because debt is really rough, yeah. But yeah, they just made sure that I graduate on time and really it came after right. Okay, just make sure you get a job after and try to work on your career. I think they focus a lot more on that.

J.R.: 8:30

Try to build a career, be successful, but just find your own path.

Alex: 8:34

They weren't too nitpicky about. You have to be a doctor or you have to be a lawyer, I think at one point I thought, oh, I should be a doctor. It was a lot more than I think people usually anticipate. It's just a very difficult road, and so I think my interest level just wasn't high enough for me to get through it.

J.R.: 8:52

Okay, so you graduated public health sciences, then what was the next step after that?

Alex: 8:58

So what job should I get out of college? And then the crazy thing is right you go back to college and you say what major should I have done for the job? After I graduated I still had no idea.

J.R.: 9:09

I just wanted to get a job and I had to pay rent right.

Alex: 9:13

So it actually took a little bit of time before I could find anything. It was tough to find a job out of college, at least for me. Tough to find a job out of college, at least for me and I didn't. I just ended up. This is so embarrassing. I did get the job because of an introduction that my mom had with a client of hers, so I didn't even get the job myself that's kind of how it is, though, like it's connections and networking and some little sprinkle, a little bit of nepotism in there yeah, it was a terrible place oh, yeah, it

Alex: 9:45

was a chinese company. It was a very much butt in seat. If you're not in your seat, you're not working. The pay was horrible. It was. I felt like I didn't have to go to college for that job. But the first job was an hr associate okay, and I didn't even know what hr was. But at the time I just thought I'm good with people and I'm a good problem solver. I can mitigate, mediate sorry, not mitigate. I can mediate conversations and at the time ai wasn't a thing. But I thought, oh, there's longevity in this, because if you're an engineer, everyone wants to hire a younger and younger engineer because they're a lot faster at doing things and as you age you slow down. And I thought, okay, well, but with HR and people, your experience actually should help you as you age, not the other way around. So I thought it would be a career with longevity. But after eight years I felt like that I wouldn't want to do it anymore.

J.R.: 10:49

Actually, Okay, so then HR. And then you felt like that there was some longevity there, and so what was the next step after that? Was it just you stayed there? Did you move around? What were your goals at that point? Well, the pay was terrible. Yeah, I had to make more money you move around.

Alex: 11:05

What were your goals at that point? Well, the pay was terrible, yeah I the goal.

Alex: 11:06

I had to make more money yeah, so early on in my first job. I think I met some amazing people in my first job that really shaped who I am today. I think one takeaway was how cheap I was. Okay, I'm kind of tan this is a tangent Go for it but I was super, super cheap because I was so frugal, like in college. My parents paid for college, so I didn't want to spend their money. I felt very responsible for everything so I didn't want to make their lives any harder than it needed to be.

Alex: 11:38

I was super frugal and when I started working I was hoping that when I made my own money I could be less frugal. But maybe I could be that way with myself, but it was hard to do that for others. So people who are less frugal would say let me buy you a meal, let me buy you a gift, let me show my thanks in this way. I really wasn't able to do that because I was a penny pincher. I wanted to make sure that everything was split fairly because I knew how hard it was to make a dollar, because I was also making no money.

Alex: 12:12

But at my first job there was this guy named Andy who always treated me out to lunch, probably more than once a week and we'd always go out and he wasn't that much older than me I'd say maybe he's like six to ten years older than me, but not a whole lot.

Alex: 12:28

Yeah, at the time, and I knew how much he made because I processed payroll and he didn't make that much more. But every single time I'm like why are you paying for me? He said I know that I make more than you and it makes me happy to be able to provide this for you. If it makes me happy to be able to provide this for you, if it makes you happy and it was a concept that I didn't understand I was like what do you mean? It makes you happy to spend your money on me? What is this People never done that for me before. And I think over time it rubbed off on me, where I started to try what he was doing and seeing how I felt, and I would start like showing my appreciation for my friends by treating them to things every now and then, even though it was very difficult in the beginning, but over time it's become a lot more commonplace and I think that's where it started. So that was one tangent of a thing, yeah, no, I like that.

J.R.: 13:22

So you're saying it was a good lesson that you learned from someone who was older than you of like how to? How do I say this? Not necessarily I don't want to say just generosity, but like how to approach money in a different way that you were used to.

Alex: 13:35

Yeah, my view of money was very different. I thought it was for yourself. Money is for yourself. It's meant to be kept, it's meant to be saved, it's meant to be cherished. But giving, not giving in a way.

J.R.: 13:54

But sharing it, yeah, brings you joy as well, and that was really odd at the time. Yeah, I get that because it's not intuitive at the surface level of that. Giving necessarily has a positive roi, because it's like the math is basically you subtract money, right, yeah, but and money equals happiness? Exactly, yeah, money this happens. But then when you go down the route that you were saying, you learn this new perspective.

J.R.: 14:12

I also subscribe to that that don't discount the amount of actual, like soft ROI that has on you, your networks, the people around you, of that abundance, generosity mindset. I found that, whether or not I have a lot of money or a little bit, the act of giving or the mindset of giving, it creates more in that act for you and for the people around you, and then that could have a ripple effect. Like I have, like friends who are younger than me, who I treat out to, and it's that your story where I'm happy to give and I'm at a point where, like I have a budget to give and I know that that not only makes me happy but it makes them happy and I tell them like I don't need anything from you. But if you ever find yourself in the same situation as I am feel free to pass that along to the next person, like that person to someone else, and I feel like that has a bigger ROI than maybe I should just save this $20 for myself. Yeah.

Alex: 15:03

So I like that.

J.R.: 15:04

Yeah. So what else did you learn on that journey? So I know you seem like you enjoy your career now, but from there, from your low paying job that you hated, and then you met this coworker. What were the points that kind of got you to where you are now? Or like the lessons that you've learned along the way?

Alex: 15:20

Yeah, so very early on I knew that your money, how much money, how do I put this? There's some sort of velocity involved where the faster you make more money, the more it's worth it. If you think about compounding interest, you obviously want more early, and it equals a lot more later. You don't want to spread it out and have it compound slowly, and it equals a lot more later. You don't want to spread it out and have it compound slowly. So very early on in my career, I tried to get as many raises as I could, as fast as I could, and so I would switch jobs every two years on average. This is probably the longest I've had a job, and I've been at this current job for a little over three years. Wow.

J.R.: 16:03

So, yeah, upr.

Alex: 16:04

Yeah, I'm not telling everyone to job switch, but I think there's definitely truth to it there's inherent value.

Alex: 16:09

Right, if you stay within the same company, you're going to get, on the low end, no raise to maybe 2% annual raise, and then on the higher end, if you don't get a promotion, you'll maybe get 7%. And so if you think about that, over time, how many years does it take you to get to 20% in a raise? Whereas if you switch jobs, on average you get 15 to 20%. So if you switch jobs enough times, then your pay just jumps over and over again and there are times when it jumps like 40% from one job to the next, probably because I was just way too low before, right. But yeah, that's what I tried to do really early on, and I can't say that I've been very successful, but I think I've been successful enough where it worked for me. I do think that loyalty in a company is sort of dead. I think if they take care of you, then yes, but if they don't take care of you, if you don't have opportunities.

J.R.: 17:09

I would suggest that you probably look elsewhere. Yeah, yeah, I like that a lot. That math is probably pretty eye-opening for some people Because, like you said, you can maybe max out a 2%, 3% raise each year and all this other stuff. But even for me and a guest of mine that I've had too is like when we switch jobs to like a similar but new title, our pay basically doubled. And so it's like you can do that when you go to different companies. And I agree with your sentiment of the whole, like company loyalty, that's the thing of the past and it's unfortunate. It'd be nice if we still had that in pensions and stuff. But the new economy of what we are today is that, like you have to look out for yourself and you have to be able to get those pay increases. So I think that insightful. The math is really insightful. Yeah, okay, so you were getting raises and pay increases and then what was after that? Like you were staying in HR, right?

Alex: 18:06

The idea was to build my career in HR and take it as high as I possibly can, to say a C-level HR officer right. But while I was on my way there, I think I just didn't. I just realized how much I didn't enjoy the work. It was a lot of people complaining. It was a lot of me feeling like I couldn't make the difference that I wanted to make In HR. A lot of me feeling like I couldn't make the difference that I wanted to make in hr. A lot of the times when you're in a higher position, what you end up doing is you're just managing layoffs all the time, and that's no fun.

Alex: 18:35

It's not fun for anybody just firing people yeah, granted, you shouldn't be the one firing them, but you're the one facilitating the process, and really that's worse in some ways because the volume right there's. So many years I just spent laying people off, giving people their paperwork, telling them what the off-boarding process is and seeing people cry or seeing people get pissed. I don't want to surround myself with that negative energy all the time. I understand that it is a necessity for the company, but you don't want to spend all your time there.

Alex: 19:11

So yeah, so that's where it went. And then now and I do see the other side of it now so currently, as a chief of staff, I do focus more on the overall health of the business, and so when you look at numbers, it's hard not to just say, oh, we're overspending in that department and it's because it's too many people. And then you also ask yourself all the time, how productive are these people? And I do want to just say that the current company that I'm working, at we're fully remote globally.

Alex: 19:45

There's no office, no one's there checking to see if you're doing your work. It's more so. Are we getting complaints from customers? Are you getting what we assigned you done in a manner that we think is acceptable? So it's a lot of self-motivation, self-management, and if people aren't doing that, then I have to think of okay, well how long do we want to pay? For someone to not do what they're supposed to do yeah.

J.R.: 20:13

So then what's your? Maybe it's not clear to me. So what's your like? Function I get you said you look at the overall health of the company yeah, so it's hard to describe.

Alex: 20:24

I do manage the hr side of things at the company still so managing the day-to-day benefits, the payroll, the hiring process, that sort of stuff. But the other side of it is how profitable is the company? What are the areas that we need to improve on? Do we need to make cuts in certain areas or do we need to invest in certain areas? These are all things that I look into more in detail through a bunch of spreadsheets and then I tried to come up with a strategy and then implement strategy after Okay. So it sounds like a lot of corporate mumbo jumbo Right, right, no, I get it.

J.R.: 21:02

So it's like you're allocating or kind of seeing the health in terms like finances and where you guys can improve and whatnot, or make more efficient cuts or whatnot.

J.R.: 21:10

So then I guess my question is in your role as going through HR, and then now what you do now as like chief of staff, what are some of the biggest takeaways that you've learned in your career, I guess in the functions that you've served, or maybe advice you would give yourself Advice I would give myself, like someone going through okay, I'm curious about HR or pursuing a similar career path as Alex Hung Maybe. What would you give that person like advice?

Alex: 21:37

I don't really have great advice, because I do feel like if you do do HR, you could of course, take that career path and go where you want it to go.

Alex: 21:47

There's a natural progression.

Alex: 21:48

When you're in the corporate ladder the way that I ended up where I'm at I think someone has to take a flyer on you because when you work in hr, you're when you work at a lower level sort of independent contributor role, or even if you're a low-level manager, you're just not exposed to the same topics and ways of thinking that maybe a ceo or see someone like the vp level would think of.

Alex: 22:18

So in order for you to make that jump, someone kind of needs to just give you the chance. I've seen a lot of managers that I'm thinking about something and I'm trying to figure out a solution and they're just not giving me what I need from them and at the end of the day, it's because they just don't think that way yet and so it's not really advice. I think people just need to give people the chance to take that leap if you want to go up to upper management, and then for me I think I got lucky because I was managing my current employer as a client and they just wanted to hire me because they felt like I worked really well with them back when I was like a third-party HR manager for them.

J.R.: 23:08

Oh, okay, okay.

Alex: 23:09

Yeah, and then I started managing a service team at a SaaS company, which was a slight change from just the day-to-day HR stuff. It was more operational, it was more managerial, and then that's when I was able to make the jump to chief of staff, which is more operational and less HR focused.

J.R.: 23:28

Yeah, I see Okay. So then I guess my last question on that is were you just the level that you're at now of skill, were you just always like that, or how did you develop that skill? I imagine I couldn't just jump into that role, or anyone else, right?

Alex: 23:45

at the end of the day, what I do is not that technical, it's all just problem solving, because it was even hard to answer your question earlier when you said what are you doing every day? Yeah, it's just whatever problems that are most prevalent for the business at that particular moment, and if no one is there to take care of it, I'm whatever problems that are most prevalent for the business at that particular moment, and if no one is there to take care of it, I'm the one that has to go and figure it out. And if I don't know how to solve for the problem, I have to find someone.

J.R.: 24:10

Dang. So you really like the one of the last. Bucks of the problems go to you, or something like that?

Alex: 24:16

Yeah, I would say that I take all the shit. Wow, that's why they that's why they pay you all the money for it, right?

J.R.: 24:25

No, you're like not enough, not enough, yeah, not enough. Nice, okay, let's switch over then. So now we talked about, we're talking about career and colleges, but there's this one thing that you mentioned in the pre-show form, which was, quote unquote college isn't necessary and is a waste of money. Would you like to elaborate on that? Yeah, not that I don't disagree, I just like to know, yeah, of course.

Alex: 24:42

So I majored in public health science and my career has nothing to do with public health science. And when we had the whole coronavirus thing, I didn't help. I didn't help at all I didn't do anything.

J.R.: 24:56

My public health science did not science anything. Yeah, I didn't science a single thing.

Alex: 25:00

So I think the biggest problem is what you learn, at least in undergrad. And even I mean I don't have an educational background right, I'm not a teacher or anything like that but when you think of what you remember that you learned in middle school, high school, college, how much do you remember that you learned high school college? How much do you remember that you learned? And for me, not very much, because I also have a terrible memory. But what I wish I learned is the practical things that I do every day and the things that matter for life.

Alex: 25:34

So, in terms of life, I would say money management, I think, is extremely important and relevant to every single person that is, at least in this economy, in this culture, right, you need to manage your money and you need to be able to do it successfully, or else it doesn't matter how much money you make, you're going to end up poor. So I wish that we learned about money and taxes and about how to maximize your return on anything that you have. So that's an interest that I have on the side, because you don't learn in school. So that's what I like to learn on my free time, and then you feel the reward from it in your bank account. Exactly, yeah.

J.R.: 26:15

Okay, quick, tangent because I put a call out to action. I always want to talk to someone about personal finance. Okay, quick, tangent, because I put a call out to action. I always want to talk to someone about personal finance. What are some TLDR quick takeaways about personal finance and financial literacy that you can give to the audience, about what you've learned about money?

Alex: 26:30

The one you probably hear a lot. I don't know if people say this just start as early as you can, because time is what makes you money. It's not because you're an amazing investor or anything like that. Just for me, it was about picking stocks and other investments that I felt like could stand the test of time that are solid enough. I was a bit in a rush, so instead of people always say, oh, just put in the S&P, put in the S&P, okay, yeah, but the S&P put in the S&P okay, yeah, but the S&P is too slow for me, so I don't do S&P sorry for all the S&P lovers out there, I go blue chip. Blue chip always helped me. What blue chip is is your Amazon's, your Apple's, your Tesla's. Not saying you should buy all of them, but there's certain ones out of those that I prefer and I feel like will stand the test of time, at least for the foreseeable future, and those are the ones that gave me the best return.

J.R.: 27:26

So invest in the stock market for you as blue chip and do it early, early. Anything else on money that let's say not necessarily investing, but I guess like personal financial literacy.

Alex: 27:40

Personal financial literacy. I think it's important to try and maximize the money that you already make. I kind of mentioned that. Take advantage of the high-yield checking accounts it's such a no-brainer thing. Take advantage of credit card programs. I mean, don't open up like 30 credit cards if you can't manage it, but there's some rewards that are very much worth it and you can pull them and use them for different things instead of spending your cash and also, yeah, don't spend above your means unless you really love the thing, yeah unless you enjoy being poor yeah, unless you enjoy enjoy being poor, yeah, okay, oh, and buy.

Alex: 28:28

If you're a guy, yeah, and you like cars, buy the car you want before you settle down. Oh, it's to enjoy it so that you can buy it, because you might not be allowed to buy oh because of being married or if you have other responsibilities in the future oh, I see, yeah, like it's better to buy early if you can afford it, than to wait. Just buy your dream car, okay I get that.

J.R.: 28:58

Yeah, see for me, I don't disagree with that. But for me, my dream car, okay, I get that. See for me, I don't disagree with that. But for me my dream car is a Lamborghini. So I have to save for that, but also-.

J.R.: 29:05

I mean you can't afford that. Right, I know, I know. But also, like they say, how wealth is money you don't spend. And so I'm just playing the long game so that at that point a Lamborghini is just a drop in the bucket, like I'm not trying to, I'm not trying to have it be the whole bucket, like even when I get there I want to have the lake and then just then a bucket for the Lamborghini, but anyways, some of us have smaller.

Alex: 29:26

No, I agree, my pond is much smaller than your Lamborghini.

J.R.: 29:35

Exactly, exactly, and it's. I have probably the longer, bigger threshold for delayed gratification than most other people, but that's just me. I hope you do get your library game. I will. I have faith It'll happen. I'm not worried. Okay, I want to go back to career really quick. There's some things maybe we won't touch on this, but you mentioned a few things of not being promoted, being stuck, not getting raises, getting laid off systems in place. What do you think are some? If you want to elaborate on any of those points, my question is really what traps do you think people fall in or what do you think people get wrong about navigating the career game?

Alex: 30:07

for myself. Maybe it's because I'm asian, but at least my parents would just say just do a good job and people will notice and they'll reward you for the good job that you do. That's very false in my opinion. I don't think that works in the US corporate economy. Maybe it does in Asia, maybe in Taiwan, I don't know. But here, if you keep your head down and you do your job well, then yeah, you might get some promotions, but you'll just get more work, most likely, and the money won't keep up with how much you're contributing. If you just do a good job but you don't say anything, likely you won't get anything and they'll just keep you where you are and nothing extravagant is going to happen. The truth, at least in my world, from my experience, is the squeaky wheel gets the oil. Truth, at least in my world, from my experience, is what is it? The squeaky wheel gets the oil right.

Alex: 31:03

The more people talk about how great they are or what they accomplished, the more people do notice, even if people aren't doing a great job. If they say they're doing a great job, some people will believe them, and sometimes it's the decision makers that believe them. So, from my experience, it's not just about doing a good job at work. You kind of have to make it known. And if you're an introvert and you don't like to brag, it's not really about bragging, but you need to make it known so that you take credit for the things that you've done. And you do also have to put yourself out there, even it is uncomfortable, and say I want this. Of course you could try and make it reasonable, but you do need to ask if that's what you want, because people don't just give you stuff like they know what you want at least, yeah, that's my take that makes sense.

J.R.: 31:57

So it's almost like it's half marketing, essentially, like you can do a good job, but if you don't promote yourself or I mean promoting, like meaning, like communicate, like the work that you're actually doing, and it just slides under the radar they could take advantage of you and be like oh yeah, they're doing good work, but you know, the squeaky wheel is not getting the grease right yeah, the silent hard worker does not get the reward Right. Great for the CEO and great for the owners.

Alex: 32:25

Ceos love the silent, non-complaining worker, it is the best. I would hire a thousand of them, Right, right. And then you have the great. Okay, if you have a great performer who's also loud loud as in they'll just keep asking for more. Yeah, yeah, sure, you'll give it to them, but at some point it's too much, like it's not worth? Yeah, it's not worth it which? Is why you switch jobs every two years.

J.R.: 32:50

So alex is the complainer who switches jobs gets.

Alex: 32:52

No, I don't, I don't complain, but I, I do consistently look for additional opportunity and when it's not there, they're not going to give it to me, because they probably felt like they gave me a lot already.

J.R.: 33:02

Yeah, yeah, yeah no, I like that and I subscribe to that too. I don't. I recommend that because I did this. I did the same thing, which was like I was always looking for the next opportunity. Obviously, I was trying to grow and get better at stuff yeah but still keeping my eyes open for the next door.

J.R.: 33:18

And then when you make that jump, it sets you up for the next one, and so being intentional about that career path or journey or hops, I feel is very important. That would set you apart. Yeah, yeah, okay, I think that should be it for the career stuff. Any last thoughts on that that you think would be valuable to the audience?

Alex: 33:36

I think comes to mind yeah.

J.R.: 33:38

No, that was solid, honestly, guys, just repeat that if you're curious about how to leapfrog the career game, because that's actually really practical tactical advice, all right. Last topic is relationships and dating insights. So we don't have to cover everything here, but my first question is to give us some context on your relationship dating journey thus far, because you mentioned this is one of the topics you want to talk about yeah, I think there's a lot of people that this is relevant to, because dating in this day and age is kind of tough.

Alex: 34:09

Yeah, for me, I was in a relationship starting in college. It was pretty long term six and a half years ended with no engagement or anything, even though that's where I was hoping to take it and then just many years of being single and chasing the feeling again, right, chasing the feeling of being wanted, chasing the feeling of being in a relationship, wondering if I'm going to end up being alone. And I guess I'll just summarize it where there was a good chunk of time where I was actively dating and looking and not really focusing on looking inward. And then there was one year where I said I'm not dating at all, I'm not gonna do any dating, I'm not gonna look at anyone like that at all and I'm just gonna focus on being alone and trying to come to terms with being okay with it.

Alex: 35:04

I think what was happening at the time was since I was such an extrovert. Maybe the extrovertedness came from not wanting to be alone, but I always looked for opportunities to hang out with people or to be in a relationship, and even though I was still, everyone has their criteria. It's not like I was dating anyone, but I was definitely looking for a certain something and worried that I might not find it. So that year that I took off, I think, really helped me. Center Sounds so cliche. I centered myself.

J.R.: 35:38

Center myself. Yeah, I found myself, centered myself, I found myself, I found myself within myself. Ew.

Alex: 35:42

But I got to the point where I thought to myself if I don't find anyone, this is actually not bad, and I think it's. That was really what I was looking for, to get to that point and I hope that everyone gets there at some point too.

J.R.: 36:01

I like that. For me, how I interpret that sort of mode of figuring out how to be alone and sending yourself so that that's your default is like a detox from needing to get validation from someone you know wanting to be with you right.

Alex: 36:17

Yeah.

J.R.: 36:17

I feel like that's very important to understand. I think we talked about that on Alex Cristal's episode as well, which is kind of like the power of solitude, like being on your own. And that can reveal to you your own self-awareness of what you really want to do, because now it's an unfiltered version of yourself that's not influenced by your desire to be with someone. Does that make sense?

Alex: 36:38

Yeah, yeah, so I like that a lot, I guess.

J.R.: 36:41

how has? Well, my next question was how has your perspective of being alone changed over time and what do you think people, what should people think about while being in this phase of being single? I don't know if that question makes sense. Can you ask?

Alex: 36:56

it again, yeah.

J.R.: 36:57

I guess for someone who wants to get to that point where they're like okay, I'm good if I'm alone, if I'm by myself, like I'm chill with this. How, how would you advise someone get to that point? I guess especially for extroverts, right?

Alex: 37:09

yeah, I think I started to look at what my motivators were for doing things, thinking am I trying to hang out with people because I just don't want to be by myself?

Alex: 37:22

Or am I hanging out with people because I think it's fun? There's nothing wrong with going out, having drinks, doing things because you think it's enjoyable but are you doing it just because you're trying to avoid something else? And so for me, I think it was maybe like a small percentage was I'm just trying to not be lonely and, of course, like part of it was, let me put myself out there because I am single. So I need to put forth the effort and put myself out there, at least be out in the world, so that I could give myself a chance. No one's going to break into my house and tell me they want to date me, right, so I have to be outside.

J.R.: 37:57

You never know that could happen. I mean, alex, date me, you're so attractive, I broke into a hot chick. Don't arrest me, but we should date.

Alex: 38:07

I mean that'd be cool, right? It doesn't work like that. So, yeah, I was trying to put myself out there, but at the same time I did think, okay, well, is it for the right reasons? And so I had to think about that. And so I had to think about that, and then I think part of it was also just thinking about who I really valued. When you do that reset, everyone has a list of what type of person that they want to be with. I think it was just hitting a reset and you put your building blocks back of the top things that you really find to be the most important.

Alex: 38:46

And then what I realized is that list was still not right. I'm actually happily in a relationship right now, which is great, very, very lucky. But yeah, I realized that I think the thing that I was looking for is still different from what I ended up with, and it's still great, right. It's not like I needed everything on that list. I think the list was still too long.

J.R.: 39:10

So do you have any examples of? Okay, so you're saying the list you reset. You made a list but it still wasn't right. Maybe could you give examples of what wasn't right about that list. And or what do you think the correct quote unquote correct list is?

Alex: 39:24

I'm sure it's personal right, but yeah, I am tempted to say that there is no correct list, because how did you know what's wrong then? Because there was a list. I think that the list was already wrong, because having the list, yeah, or like expecting everything to be checked off on the list, is already wrong, because no matter how you build the list, it's not going to be what you end up with, I think at least the majority, so it's having like having this long list of expectations is likely not going to work out right.

Alex: 39:53

I think it's fine to say these are things that are very important to me, that are non-negotiables, but it can't be more than three like. You need to calm down and just know that there and there are some things that you think are non-negotiables that should absolutely be negotiables, because I think some people put in the wrong category you have some examples of those things, yes.

Alex: 40:12

So one for me was as as more of an extroverted person who really loves concerts, live music and festive-type environments, I always wanted to be with someone that could enjoy those with me, and my current girlfriend is quite introverted and so it's not like she won't go to those things, but there's a limit to how long she could be in that environment before she gets kind of tired and she can't hang. But I'm always the type that's let's go to the end, right, let's have fun all the way. Maybe I take a little too far and I have one too many drinks and I'm getting old, so I should stop doing that anyway. But I thought that I wanted to share that sort of life with somebody. But yeah, that's definitely not a non-negotiable.

Alex: 41:03

I think there's a lot that people can offer in terms of value if they don't necessarily share all the same interests as you, even if it's an interest that you find to be very important to you. There's still other ways that people can provide value to you that you probably haven't even placed that high on your list. You that you probably haven't even placed that high on your list. So that's what I mean by you might be surprised at what you swap out from your tops list.

J.R.: 41:30

Do you have an example of, in your opinion, two or three really solid things that you think are good to have on that list?

Alex: 41:38

I think the top. I mean I'm a little bit older, so I'm not in my twenties anymore. I definitely dated quite differently at the time. But in my thirties, the main thing is how do you see your future? Right, not even who do you want to date right now. It's not who do you want to date right now, it's who do you want to be with later. And so I think being aligned on the future that you're going to have is really important, of course, like the question of kids is very important. Do you want to have kids or not have kids? Religion is usually a big topic. If people are very religious and someone's not very religious, then does the not very religious person feel like there's pressure to be religious as well? So those are the values that I think are pretty important.

J.R.: 42:24

Yeah. I like that, I feel like mine would probably be similar to that too. What are your long-term goals? Are ours aligned Like, what do you see for yourself at our age? Right and yeah, religion.

J.R.: 42:36

And for me, I guess I don't know, I feel like I really highly value health or taking care of yourself yes because if I want to marry this person and have kids with them and they're going to be the mother of my children I would want them to also have the same values of like longevity and taking care of ourselves, so that we can be the best versions of ourselves for our family. So, yeah, I agree with that. I feel like thinking those long terms is different than if you're just younger, in your 20s or whatever, and you're just like I just want to eat someone who have vibes and chemistry and yeah, vibes like feelings exactly or we love to like an alex cristal's episode, like playmates right, someone you can have fun with, go to raves with or whatever.

J.R.: 43:13

Maybe at that time of your life that's what you want. You want someone to have fun with, but then, at different stages, you want someone else for different reasons I think I heard this.

Alex: 43:23

Maybe it was on another podcast, somewhere, a radio show or something. Radio show wait, hold on. I just dated myself. It's too late. No, no, it wasn't from a radio show, uh from the 60s my radio show, uh, but I almost lost my train of thought. It was crap. It was, oh, the idea where your significant other has to be everything for you, right? It has to be your playmate it has to be your lover. It has to be your care.

Alex: 43:56

Take, I don't know the person that you love and do all the things with. So for me, I learned over time that that's not necessarily it. They're your partner and you can still have friends. It sounds weird Friends that are playmates.

J.R.: 44:12

Right, yeah, yeah.

Alex: 44:13

Like your yeah, your friends. You could play with your friends. Your friends are there to help you have a good time and to explore the interests that you have, and that's why you have different types of friends. And then your partner is there for life.

J.R.: 44:30

It's more life stuff and hopefully you can still have fun. It's not all business, right, but yeah, that's almost exactly what we're talking about on alex alex cristal show alex's thing yeah, the alex's think alike, they're all about those well.

J.R.: 44:37

so I was joking around with him because he's, like it was, he's looking for a girl to have fun with, like a playmate, right. And then I was like, yeah, girl, he's not looking for an intelligent girl, he's not looking for a mind mate, he's looking for a girl to play with and just shut up, don't talk and let's just have fun, just laugh with me, just laugh with me. I don't want to hear you speak, no, but like, because he was talking about how he like goes to disneyland and movies and all that stuff. So he's, and he's looking for someone to do those fun things with, right, but you don't necessarily need to have your partner also be your mind mate or your help mate or whatever, or something like that. Obviously, soulmate is ideal, right, like the romantic, intimate side, but they don't necessarily need to be the other three. What you're?

J.R.: 45:15

saying too like they don't have to be everything soulmate interesting concept yeah, that was a, so guys listen to it if you haven't. But it was the four mates soulmate, playmate, mind mate and help me.

Alex: 45:28

And so that's how he conceptualized he learned from someone in culture shock or something like that interesting.

J.R.: 45:32

Yeah, so it was really good. I was thinking about that since the christmas party that we had. Because he told me about that, I was like dang rent free in my head. Okay, anything else on that topic. We are just about time. I have one more question, but I don't know if you had any other thoughts on dating relationships and what they should think about well, that's good for now did you have anything that you learned in the realm of quote-unquote understanding women?

Alex: 45:58

yeah, the main thing was, in my 20s I really thought that men and women weren't that different, like, oh, we're all humans, we all have interests, we all have the same motivators, we all eat, we all. Yeah, I thought it. I thought we weren't that different and so I approached women more like how I approached everybody. That was in my life, which I learned in my 30s that it's not the right way to do it.

Alex: 46:24

Could you clarify on that? It's hard to specify what it is, but women are very different in the way that they think. One specific thing now that I think about it is men are typically more logical, and you can't really logic your way out of things with most people if they're more emotional, and so I think women tend to be more emotional and less logical in certain situations, and so that was something that, and also the appeal right For men. The appeal for us is very logical. Why do you like that? Oh, I like it because X, y, z I will tell you exactly why I like it. For women, they're like oh, I don't know, I just it's a vibe, it's just yeah, I just feel it just feels good and you're like what do you mean?

Alex: 47:09

Explain it to me. And they're like I can't really. It's just how I feel.

J.R.: 47:26

And so you have, you appeal to that. Then what did you learn? I still don't know. Oh, I mean, as someone who now has a girlfriend, how do you tend to appeal in that situation where your logic and she's like more emotion-based?

Alex: 47:33

okay, you just have to do things that appeal to their emotions a little bit more, and that sounds very, very broad. But you do things that you know that they'll like, okay, and even if it's something that's a little bit out of the way for you or a little bit inconvenient for you, but you do it because you know that it'll make them feel happy. And for guys, I feel like we don't need that sometimes. Oh yeah, just do something simple and that's fine. But if they have a particular thing that makes them happy, that it goes a lot longer, it goes a lot further yeah, I like that.

J.R.: 48:09

I think we ended on that. It's more just like. You don't need to approach it in a logical way sometimes, for it's generalization right, but for women or maybe more emotional based people, you have to approach it in a way that you're trying to. The outcome is to get them to feel a certain way, and that's more influential than saying, well, a one plus one is two, so therefore that's what it is Right.

Alex: 48:31

Yeah, I like that.

J.R.: 48:32

Yeah, cool, you ready for rapid fire questions, let's go. Yes, first question billboard question the most famous one.

Alex: 48:47

if you could have a sign for millions of people to see, what would it say? It's not that serious. I'll elaborate. I don't know if there should be more on the sign, but I think most people are frustrated with things and what I remind myself is it's not that serious. And most of the time, whatever you're upset with is not that serious. I like it.

J.R.: 48:57

What is one of the hardest challenges you face in your life and what'd you learn from it? Hardest challenge Skip Nice. What is a self-inflicted wound?

Alex: 49:10

What's a story about something that's gone wrong in your life. That was your own fault and you can't blame anyone else. I think it was maybe with dating. I liked a girl a little too quickly and I was too expressive about how I felt too quickly and she wasn't ready for it, and then that's what caused the one year of me being date free.

Alex: 49:30

So good, learning lesson there. But yeah, don't. Oh, that is part of it. Is logically, you think, if I like a girl, then I will tell her how I feel and she will return how I feel, with how she feels, obviously.

J.R.: 49:44

But yeah, this doesn't work like that.

Alex: 49:46

Going back to the previous topic, right Appealing to their emotions, is you need to meet them where they are, not where?

J.R.: 49:52

you are. I like that. I could go on a whole tangent for five minutes about that topic, but maybe next time.

Alex: 49:57

Maybe part two, all right, If you could redo one thing, what would you do differently? I'm pretty happy with everything as a thought experiment. Uh, something, there was something I would redo. Oh, after I bought my house, I was trying to mount my tv. I heard the story and little did I know. The wall that you're supposed to mount the TV on had water pipes right in the smack dab center. Who?

J.R.: 50:27

put those pipes there?

Alex: 50:28

Yeah, who put them there? That's just bad engineering. And so I drilled right into it and couldn't turn it off, because it wasn't a domestic water line, it was a sprinkler system water line that was in a locked room, so it was going off for over an hour and no one had a key to that room. No one knew how to turn it off. The fire department couldn't even turn it off because they couldn't get into that room. So, yeah, ruined my house Less than a month after I moved in. So, yeah, don't drill into your walls, don't drill into your walls. Haphazard, haphazard, haphazard.

J.R.: 51:02

Check for pipes. Yeah, yeah, I like it. Yeah, that's a good one. If you could give your younger self advice, what would you say?

Alex: 51:10

Don't compare yourself to other people. Some people just get luckier than you and they might make more money than you, faster than you, even though they're not smarter than you. It's fine, it's okay. Yeah, I like it.

J.R.: 51:23

In the last few years, what new belief, behavior or habit has changed your life the most?

Alex: 51:33

I think it was a combination of some of the stuff we talked about, but it was about being alone and focusing on being with yourself, and I think that attracts people naturally, and so the result of that is I'm in a happy relationship, nice.

J.R.: 51:44

I like it. If you knew you couldn't fail, what would you be doing right now?

Alex: 51:48

Ooh, gambling Really.

J.R.: 51:51

Just kidding.

Alex: 51:51

No, it's like money. Give me money faster, yeah, but if you couldn't fail, why wouldn't you? Sure Lotto, let's go. That's a good answer.

J.R.: 52:02

Yeah, good answer yeah sure I'll go.

Alex: 52:03

If you knew you would fail absolutely, what would you do anyway? I think back in college, being on that dance team, I definitely almost failed physics I think I did. I mean, I got a d or something. This is the lowest grade I've ever gotten in my life, I think. But I'd do it again, because college grades don't matter unless you're going to grad school and the experiences last forever.

J.R.: 52:24

I like it. Is there anything you've been pondering recently or something that you often think about deeply?

Alex: 52:31

I think it's just how do I get to my next goal? How do I attain what I want? What is your next goal? Bigger house, okay, well, yeah, like how to make more money. It's the thing that everyone's sure.

J.R.: 52:45

Yeah, it's not actually very interesting, but yeah, it's what everyone deals with, it's all good. Do you have a favorite hot take or something that you think most people won't agree with? Besides the whole college thing oh, that's not contentious enough? I don't think so, At least not for my podcast guests. Nothing's coming to mind. What is one of the best or most worthwhile investments you've ever made in either time, money or energy, etc. Time, money or energy.

Alex: 53:13

I want to avoid the cliche health is wealth thing, but I do think that taking care of your body is very important. Yeah, can I switch it a little bit and say these are the things that I bought? Sure that saved me time yeah, I love them yeah, okay one. I bought this thing that you attach in your toilet where you wave your hand and it flushes for you, and it is life-changing. I really hate pressing. Yeah, the thing to flush the toilet now, and coupled with that is, of course, a bidet.

J.R.: 53:45

Everyone needs a bidet.

Alex: 53:46

If you go bidet, you can't go back to not bidet, so yeah, I like that.

J.R.: 53:52

When Alex was first still building out his house and getting all this stuff, I was following his Instagram stories and he showed the toilet thing, the automatic flush you just wave your hand over it.

Alex: 54:06

I'm like, oh, that's so cool, that is so useful yeah, you don't know how helpful because you think, oh, it's just, yeah, just do that, why is it so hard?

J.R.: 54:10

but when you just wave your hand instead, wow, you're a wizard, harry yeah I like it well, I guess, on that note, favorite recent purchase under or in 50 to 100 range that has impacted your life the most in the last six months so I I have a friend who's an optometrist shout out, janine who are aspiring as optometrists in school right now, but everyone looks at screens all the time.

Alex: 54:33

Your eyes get really dry and her suggestion was to get a like a eye warmer thing so you can buy. It looks like goggles, okay, and it's like it heats up a little bit so that it helps with the oils in your eyelids and it unblocks your ducts oh yeah, that's pretty helpful and you just use it a little bit, even in massages if you get different ones. That's been pretty helpful to help with dry eyes.

J.R.: 55:01

Oh okay, dry eyes, oh interesting, that's cool. I've never heard of that before.

Alex: 55:04

Yeah, I massage your mask warmer.

J.R.: 55:08

Well, I mean, that sounds lovely.

Alex: 55:09

Yeah, I can imagine that.

J.R.: 55:11

It's great, All right. Last rapid fire question Favorite books, movies, videos the most.

Alex: 55:26

There's a podcast that I listen to a lot. It's called All In it's, where I get a lot of my political news, even though I'm not super interested in that part, but they do a lot of startup news and stuff that's happening in tech, and so when I was starting in the company that I am at right now, I think I wanted to better understand the language that they speak in, always talking about ROI and COGS and gross margins and all that you know, whatever. So I wanted to better be able to speak like them, or at least understand what the heck they're saying, and when I first started listening to their podcast, I feel like I understood half of what they're saying, and now it's gotten a little bit better. So that's one that I do quite like. I think it's full of very smart people that are influential in just corporate America and even in politics. So that's yeah, that's one All in Okay.

J.R.: 56:14

Anything else Media recommendations across the board. Anything else Media.

Alex: 56:22

Nothing that's edifying, just entertaining. Yeah, did you have any come to mind? I watch too much Netflix and anime. It's too many, okay.

J.R.: 56:31

Top anime. Top anime right now Top anime rec Forever that you would give right now.

Alex: 56:38

It's hard to think because I'm in the middle of watching black clover. It's, I think it's okay, okay, it's good, it's getting there, yeah, but some of the tops I I liked solo leveling a lot. The pace of it it's actually almost not okay. What do you mean if every anime, if every anime, was that well animated and paced that quickly? It's almost like we have this issue with too much dopamine already. I get what you're saying. Right, we don't have the patience. It's too much. It's great, but it might be too much. We don't have the patience for any other anime after that Because we think, oh, let's-.

J.R.: 57:17

You're breaking the standards too much.

Alex: 57:18

Yeah, let's hurry up, let's get to the fight, yeah. And then I don't want to listen to this backstory.

J.R.: 57:24

Right, soul leveling, they don't care, no backstory, yeah yeah, yeah, I'm just going to stab this next monster and level up.

Alex: 57:30

Yeah, let me just punch him through this wall, yeah yeah, yeah, I love it.

J.R.: 57:33

It's a good rec, I like for our questions. Then we'll go to ending questions, so gratitude, we like to end with gratitude. Shout out to my mom, alex, what are you grateful for?

Alex: 57:45

I am so grateful for the people that support me, the people who care about me, the people who ask me how I'm doing. I hope that I could keep those people around as long as I possibly can, even though, you know, people kind of have their own things, that they have to focus on different stages of their life. So for them and my family. Nice.

J.R.: 58:09

Not your girlfriend. I'm a girlfriend. I'm just kidding. I'm just throwing under the bus Any final ask from the audience or takeaways that you would like them to have from this conversation them to have from this conversation.

Alex: 58:25

I just hope that I hope everyone has some sort of takeaway from this that there's a lot of stress happening in the world all the time and it goes back to the billboard thing, which is it's probably not that serious. So hopefully everyone just focuses on being happy and focusing on the things that honestly make them happy, not just the superficial things that make them happy, and try to keep those as close to themselves as possible I love it, yeah, so not the superficial cars I like, yeah, I mean yeah, that's not what makes me happy ah, okay, yeah not, not really.

Alex: 59:00

It's nice to have. It's a nice to have. Yeah, it's a nice I get you cool.

J.R.: 59:03

All right, alex, where can we find you if people want to connect or see what you're up to or whatnot?

Alex: 59:08

any social media handles websites, emails, etc yeah, my social media is hung on life. Yes, sir, it is a private profile, but if you dm me I will respond. If you're not crazy, we're not crazy. You can also find me on LinkedIn and I will have a very outdated photo of myself, just like the title card of this episode is a very outdated photo of myself, because I don't take pictures myself it's okay, I don't either yeah, it's not good, we'll link his socials.

J.R.: 59:33

You can go hit him up if you want to break into his house and ask to date him. We'll see how that goes I don't need that anymore.

J.R.: 59:39

He doesn't need it anymore, but it would surprise him. So I would be very surprised. Anyone has the same sense of humor as I do. Go for it, alright, alex. Well, that is it. Thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate it. Like I mentioned, hopefully we can do a part two sometime with the whole gang in the other studio. That's my. That was my dream goal six. We'll see if that happens. I appreciate it, man. Thanks for having me. Yeah, this is cool. Yeah, yeah, all right. So my final sign off for the audience. This is where the music plays. Thank you guys for being here. I really appreciate it. Be sure to like, subscribe, whatever you guys do, whatever platform you're listening to this. I really appreciate it. Yeah, just share it out if you enjoyed this and let me know what you liked about it and I'll respond. And then just a reminder to be kind to other people, especially yourself, and reminder that you can always learn something from someone if you take the time to listen. So thanks for being here. Thanks for listening.